tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post3390239872625510532..comments2024-02-23T15:34:32.816-05:00Comments on The Mad Fermentationist - Homebrewing Blog: Hoppy American Pale Ale Tasting X 2The Mad Fermentationist (Mike)http://www.blogger.com/profile/07379932734747507258noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-62840849821654071302012-12-18T07:37:34.374-05:002012-12-18T07:37:34.374-05:00The yeast character doesn't taste like a class...The yeast character doesn't taste like a classic clean-lager fermentation to me, but it's certainly possible to get interesting esters by fermenting the right strain at ale temperatures. Was the study genetic? Given that the yeast came from Greg Noonan (who knows lagers) it is certainly possible.<br /><br />Kristen England suggested to me that he thought the strain was the original Ballantine yeast (which is available from East Coast Yeast these days).<br /><br />The Mad Fermentationist (Mike)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07379932734747507258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-19384124513048150832012-12-18T00:31:32.957-05:002012-12-18T00:31:32.957-05:00What are your thoughts on this Conan yeast being a...What are your thoughts on this Conan yeast being a modified lager yeast? There has been some studying of the dregs of Heady Topper and and 9 of the 10 colonies were of the lager variety. RCognitionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11603262835750723380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-87978942427162088672012-09-22T23:13:53.570-04:002012-09-22T23:13:53.570-04:00Like most homebrewers I've brewed many an IPA ...Like most homebrewers I've brewed many an IPA with various yeast strains. I still haven't found a strain that I like more than US-05 dry yeast. It has a great peachy ester flavor that I love and its half the price of most strains.HolzBrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08551917356646521925noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-1175792850247672532012-09-21T06:25:41.704-04:002012-09-21T06:25:41.704-04:00Sadly it is a private/proprietary strain that the ...Sadly it is a private/proprietary strain that the Alchemist uses, only available by by culturing the dregs from a can of Heady Topper.The Mad Fermentationist (Mike)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07379932734747507258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-76507711028689879312012-09-20T22:05:55.939-04:002012-09-20T22:05:55.939-04:00I've never heard of the Conan yeast strain bef...I've never heard of the Conan yeast strain before. Is it available to homebrewers? If so, what is it best suited for? American ales?HolzBrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08551917356646521925noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-11243288678942909292012-09-20T09:16:27.535-04:002012-09-20T09:16:27.535-04:00I love the debate about Belgian yeast in IPAs. Cer...I love the debate about Belgian yeast in IPAs. Certain schools of thought say that it is a terrible idea with horrible clashing flavors. Personally, I think the more fruity strains can do wonderful things with American hops. I once used Citra to dryhop a saison brewed with the infamous Dupont strain. The tropical fruit from the hops had an amazing interplay with the fruity yeast. I think focusing on fruity yeasts as opposed to really phenolic ones goes a long way in preventing clashing flavors.NicKhttp://www.thepourreport.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-46210080533805070452012-09-18T18:58:06.405-04:002012-09-18T18:58:06.405-04:00I drank a ton of Alchemist beers, and never picked...I drank a ton of Alchemist beers, and never picked up a clove note.<br /><br />I'm pretty sure conan is of english origin, given the fact that it comes from Greg Noonan, a pioneer of the american brewpub/craft beer scene, which (especially in new england), is heavily english influenced.Natenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-50217726565972184132012-09-18T16:00:50.466-04:002012-09-18T16:00:50.466-04:00Been looking forward to reading about your results...Been looking forward to reading about your results. It sounds like we ended up with fairly different outcomes, as I didn't get anything spicy or phenolic from the batches I've brewed with Conan. I posted everything I learned from my culturing experiment in a write-up here: http://www.bear-flavored.com/2012/09/culturing-conan-aka-alchemists-heady.html. I'll have full tasting notes on the IPA I brewed posted to my blog on Thursday too.<br /><br />The peach / apricot character was the strongest take-away from the beer, for me. My IPA was heavily dry-hopped too (Citra, Summit and Apollo, going for a sort of orange/peach/tropical character) and my favorite aspect of it is that Conan seems to back up the dry-hops with its big peach smell. After the IPA, I brewed a winter warmer on the yeast cake and fermented it cool, and my hydrometer sample of that smelled like straight-up peach juice despite the darker malts. I could barely believe how fruity this yeast is.<br /><br />You mentioned that your batch got up to 69 degrees the first night of fermentation, and I wonder if that was maybe responsible for the spicy phenols. Kimmich stressed that temp was crucial, and it seems like Conan likes it cooler. (I fermented both my IPA and winter warmer around 64ish, then let warm up to 66 and finally 68 after fermentation settled down.) <br /><br />What sort of FG did your Conan batch end up at? It's looking like it averages about 80% attenuation.Bear Flavoredhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16217501752031139256noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-47341942174504893002012-09-18T14:18:42.740-04:002012-09-18T14:18:42.740-04:00Sadly, I don't believe a microscope is enough ...Sadly, I don't believe a microscope is enough to identify similar strains. I believe genomic research would be the only viable analytic method for picking a related strain. Although maybe someone who knows a bit more about these sorts of things could chime in?<br /><br />Certainly isolating the yeast for propagation would be ideal. Sadly that isn't in my skill set, yet. <br /><br />I haven't been to England since I got into good beer. However I’ve drank enough freshly imported English beers and enough American beers brewed with their yeast strains to have a pretty good idea that what I tasted was not a common/typical English yeast. While many English strains can be very fruity/yeasty they do not tend to be phenolic (clove/spicy) as Belgian ale strains. While esters ebb and flow with age, phenols tend to be pretty stable. <br /><br />With that said, there are several possible ways that it did start as an English strain. It could be that through repeated repitchings, it has muted and now creates compounds not produced by the original strain. It could be that those phenols came from a wild yeast that got into my culture. Or maybe it is just a very unique English strain from a brewery I haven’t had a beer from.The Mad Fermentationist (Mike)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07379932734747507258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-17290125901581582342012-09-18T14:13:46.129-04:002012-09-18T14:13:46.129-04:00I'm thinking along the same lines as Anonymous...I'm thinking along the same lines as Anonymous, above. If you take a house strain out of the house, does it remain the same strain? Or do you start to change it by the way you culture it? Obviously the potential changes between taking an English yeast to America are larger than taking a yeast out of a relatively local brewery into your own setup. But everything from water, average temperature, type of malt used in starter worts etc is going to potentially change the yeast away from the exact characteristics it has as a brewery's house strain.John Evenshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14735622705441450427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-56375708429605025512012-09-18T12:09:38.081-04:002012-09-18T12:09:38.081-04:00Per your comment that you perceive the yeast to be...Per your comment that you perceive the yeast to be more Belgian than English, can I ask (without seeming condescending) if you have ever tasted UK ales on home turf? I only say this because when I did, I was blown away by how many had full on yeast expression, and how much I identified such strong yeast notes with "Belgian" beers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-11047187805511923152012-09-18T09:28:41.520-04:002012-09-18T09:28:41.520-04:00To seriously culture a new yeast like that, I woul...To seriously culture a new yeast like that, I would streak it out on a plate and isolate single colonies.<br /><br />I recall reading on HomeBrew Digest about a decade ago about a subtle infection that would strip away malt flavor - ought to try and track down the original source of that but the HBD archives are a depressing mess.Royskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06370434387575620172noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8066877917844499643.post-90031325558077152932012-09-18T09:05:33.033-04:002012-09-18T09:05:33.033-04:00Really interesting. I wonder if it's something...Really interesting. I wonder if it's something, someone with a microscope could look at and identify a common reletive of the strain, or if it's something that is totally unique. I don't have enough bio/chem knowledge to know. Either way, I've never picked up clove from the original, so it's gotta be a product of the fermentation, like pitch rate, or ferm temp profile. I'm now tempted to make 6 1g batches to see what combination produces the heady like profile.AOhttp://www.thebottlefarm.comnoreply@blogger.com